The Scuttlebutt: Understanding Military Culture

Le Ly Hayslip, Child of the Vietnam War

We are privileged to welcome Le Ly Hayslip, whose memoir, When Heaven and Earth Changed Places, was the first to bring the story of a former Viet Cong and Vietnam refugee to American readers. Oliver Stone later made the book into a major motion picture starring Tommy Lee Jones. Ms. Hayslip is the founder of the East Meets West Foundation, now known as Thrive Networks.

Her story is one of unimaginable trauma somehow matched by powerful resilience and a will to thrive.

She was born in poverty in a village near Da Nang as the First Indochina War neared it height. What Americans call the Vietnam War followed, and her village became a frontline for the conflict between the Viet Cong and South Vietnamese government forces, backed by the United States.

As a teenager, Le Ly joined the Viet Cong, primarily as a result of her village’s political leanings and the influence they held over the area. Her role involved basic support tasks such as cooking and transporting supplies, but she also set booby traps and planted mines. She was arrested and tortured by South Vietnamese forces, who suspected her of espionage for the Viet Cong. This experience was traumatizing, and after her release, she faced suspicion from the Viet Cong as well, who questioned her loyalty. The double scrutiny and resulting abuses left her isolated and vulnerable.

To escape the violence and constant threat of harm, Le Ly left her village and found work in Da Nang, where she encountered new struggles. She took on various jobs to survive–many of them illegal–and became involved with American soldiers, which brought a degree of financial stability but exposed her to new risks.

In the early 1970s, Le Ly met Ed Munro, an American civilian contractor who eventually became her husband. Their relationship offered her a way out of Vietnam, and she emigrated to the United States with him. Upon arrival, Le Ly faced a new set of challenges: culture shock, language barriers, and the struggle to adapt to an entirely different way of life. Although safe from the violence of war, she was haunted by the trauma of her past and had to navigate the demands of her new life as a mother and immigrant.

After settling in the United States, Le Ly worked a variety of jobs to support herself and her children. Though she and Munro eventually divorced, Le Ly persevered, working to provide for her family and find stability. Her journey gave her a unique perspective on both Vietnamese and American cultures, and over time, she began to process her experiences by writing her memoir, When Heaven and Earth Changed Places, published in 1989. In it, she shared her personal account of life during the Vietnam War, her family’s struggles, and her journey to America. Her story offered an intimate view of the human cost of war, aiming to bridge understanding between Americans and Vietnamese.

Le Ly’s memoir caught the attention of American film director Oliver Stone, who was moved by her story and its focus on the impact of war on civilians, especially women. Stone had already explored the Vietnam War from an American perspective in Platoon and Born on the Fourth of July. With Heaven and Earth, released in 1993, he completed his Vietnam War trilogy, this time focusing on the Vietnamese experience. The film, adapted from Le Ly’s memoirs When Heaven and Earth Changed Places and Child of War, Woman of Peace, follows her journey from Vietnam to America, highlighting her experiences with violence, survival, and resilience.

Beyond her writing, Le Ly became a humanitarian and advocate for peace and reconciliation. In 1988, she founded the East Meets West Foundation, an organization dedicated to improving relations between Vietnam and the United States and aiding Vietnamese communities in need. The foundation has supported various projects, including medical assistance, educational programs, and infrastructure development, helping Vietnamese people affected by the war rebuild their lives. Through her humanitarian work, Le Ly sought to bridge the gap between her two worlds, fostering understanding and healing across cultures.

Le Ly Hayslip’s life story reflects the complexities of war, survival, and adaptation. Her work as an author, film collaborator, and humanitarian has contributed to greater awareness of the Vietnam War’s impact on civilians and helped foster cross-cultural understanding. Through her story and her efforts, she has become a powerful advocate for peace and a testament to resilience amid the devastation of war.

We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

What's Wrong with "Happy Veterans Day"?

Veterans Day Open Conversation ranges far and wide settling on this first opening question: is it right and proper to wish a veteran a "Happy Veterans Day." The consensus among our veterans is that it isn't, though Todd offers a tepid dissent. 

In the course of the conversation, we also examine the distinctions made between Veterans and "Combat Veterans," "Vietnam Veterans" and "Vietnam Era Veterans," and the propriety of saying "thank you for your service."

Some veterans feel awkward or uncomfortable when people say "Happy Veterans Day" or "Thank you for your service." Younger veterans, in particular, often feel these phrases are too generic. It seems an empty, overused phrase that lacks genuine understanding. Some don’t view their service as extraordinary, but rather as a job they signed up for and completed. For them, the phrase “thank you for your service” can feel impersonal, as if it’s used to satisfy social etiquette rather than express true appreciation. Some even feel it allows civilians to alleviate guilt about not having served themselves, without truly engaging with the challenges veterans face.

For some, the recognition doesn’t align with the pride they take in their service or with the fact that they volunteered for it, unlike those who served in past wars when there was a draft.

Acknowledging a veteran in a way that opens the door to more meaningful interaction can feel more genuine. Instead of only expressing thanks, some veterans suggest engaging more personally: ask about their specific roles, current lives, or goals. For those who wish to show appreciation, actions like volunteering or educating oneself on veterans’ issues are more meaningful ways to honor their sacrifices and uphold the freedoms they served to protect.

The Veterans Breakfast Club isn't  just for veterans. It's for everyone who wants to understand the lives of those who served. Whether you’re a veteran seeking camaraderie, a civilian wanting to learn, or simply someone who appreciates the value of service, the VBC welcomes you . Join us online – become part of their mission to honor stories, build bridges, and ensure that every day is Veterans Day.

We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

Veterans Open Conversation

VBC Scuttlebutt Open Conversation is a friendly, interactive gathering of veterans, friends of veterans, and history nerds where we discuss whatever aspects of military service, past or present, or the veterans community that are on our minds.

Join us to swap stories, good and bad, at home and overseas, old and new.

We’ve asked Lt. Colonel John J. McBrearty–“Colonel Mack”–to join us to talk about his 32 years Army and Marine Corps service, as well as his voluminous writing about American history, military experience, and other topics.

We’ve also invited Vietnam Navy veterans John Denk and Tracy Garner to come on and talk about the Navy side of Linebacker II, the last major US operation of the Vietnam War in December 1972.

Denk was aboard the USS Floyd B Parks (DD-884) during the operation and saw USS Goldsborough (DDG-20) get hit by NVA counter-battery rounds on December 19, 1972. The last three Navy blue water sailors killed in Vietnam were aboard: the Donald Dix, Robert Dow, and Gary Boyce.

Damage aboard on the Goldsborough, December 19, 1972
We’ll also talk about whatever topics or questions you’d like to bring up!

We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

Author Rona Simmons on “No Average Day: The 24 Hours of October 24, 1944”

Historian Rona Simmons joins us to talk about a single day in World War II: October 24, 1944. Those 24 hours were the deadliest for U.S. service members during World War II.

This day, however, is not widely known in the same way as events like Pearl Harbor or D-Day. It was an “average” day in the vast scale of the war, yet for the 2,600 soldiers, sailors, airmen, and marines who died, and their families, it was anything but average.

In her book No Average Day: The 24 Hours of October 24, 1944, historian Rona Simmons meticulously chronicles the tragic events of that day, highlighting the personal stories behind the statistics. The title captures her main argument—that no day in war, especially for those who lost their lives, is truly “average.” She recounts how these individuals, from all walks of life and different parts of the country, were ordinary people thrust into extraordinary circumstances. They ranged from cooks to clerks, riflemen to machinists, who all perished in ways as varied as their backgrounds: in hand-to-hand combat, drowning, burning, being shot down in aircraft, or perishing in ship sinkings.

One of the most notable tragedies of that day was the sinking of the Japanese “hellship” Arisan Maru, which was transporting American POWs. It accounted for two-thirds of the deaths, as hundreds of prisoners died when the ship was torpedoed by a U.S. submarine, unaware it was carrying Americans.

The narrative of No Average Day emphasizes the forgotten or overlooked moments of war—those skirmishes and lesser-known incidents in which many perished, whose names and stories often didn’t make headlines. Simmons underscores the human cost of these “small” deaths, which were part of the larger machinery of war but equally important in understanding its human toll.

The personal stories, like those of Paul Miller, who died in a Japanese POW camp, and Wanza Matthews, killed in a submarine attack, are framed against a chaotic global war, yet these soldiers’ final moments are intimately told, adding depth to their sacrifice. Simmons’ account, through thorough research and personal artifacts, seeks to give voice to the individuals behind the numbers, reflecting on how each death rippled through their families and communities.

Ultimately, Simmons argues that while October 24, 1944, might seem like just another day in the vast timeline of World War II, it was anything but average for the thousands who gave their lives. The title No Average Day captures this essence, illustrating how the personal costs of war transcend the statistics.

We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

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Veterans Open Conversation

Our monthly Open Conversation with military veterans focuses on Navy veterans in recognition of the the US Navy’s 249th birthday celebrated on October 13. We'll have Navy veterans sharing stories, answering questions, and describing why their branch is the best. 

We'll also hear from Beverly, Massachusetts, and Navy history expert Rich Pescatore on the real origins of the US Navy. 

Vietnam Veteran Walt Brinker, USMA Class of 1966, tells us why his men in the 173rd Airborne and 1st Cav in 1966-1967 never used bandoliers for the M-60 ammunition.

Ralph and Eric Grabowsky give us an update on their research on "Little John," the largest calibre gun in history.

The origins of the United States Navy lie in the siege of Boston and the city’s occupation by the British Army in 1775. After the Battle of Bunker Hill, when the Continentals sensed British vulnerability, newly commissioned General George Washington called for a ship that could patrol off shore to prevent the British from being resupplied by sea. Naval support could also obtain resources for the Continental forces.

The Continental Congress wasn’t so keen on a Navy. Ships were expensive and the British fleet’s power was overwhelming. 

Washington, then, acted on his own. On September 2, 1775, he ordered the schooner Hannah be commissioned as the first authorized patriot warship. The Hannah was a small vessel, crewed by civilians and captained by Nicholas Broughton, tasked with raiding British supply ships off the coast of Massachusetts. While not an official navy vessel, the Hannah set an important precedent by showing that naval warfare could complement the land-based efforts of the Continental Army.

Following the success of the Hannah, Washington commissioned other vessels to harass British ships, but these early efforts were ad hoc, operating under the authority of the Continental Army rather than an organized navy. 

On October 13, 1775, the Continental Congress took decisive action, officially authorizing the creation of a Continental Navy. The Congress passed a resolution to outfit two ships, tasked with intercepting British supply vessels. This date is now celebrated as the official birthday of the United States Navy. Over the next several months, the Continental Congress expanded the fleet, commissioning additional ships and appointing officers to lead them. 

Its early successes included raids on British ships and supply lines, which weakened the enemy's war effort and boosted American morale. Constantly underfunded and undersupplied, the Continental Navy nonetheless helped secure international alliances, especially with France, which joined the war on the side of the American colonies in 1778.

With the Treaty of Paris signed in 1783, formally ending the American Revolution, the newly independent United States dismantled the Navy, and its ships were sold off.

Without a navy, the U.S. government had little means of protecting its commercial interests abroad, and the constant harassment of American ships by pirates and European powers underscored the need for a naval revival.

Congress passed the Naval Act of 1794, which authorized the construction of six frigates, marking the formal revival of the U.S. Navy. These ships, which would become known as the "Original Six Frigates", included the USS Constitution, USS United States, USS President, USS Congress, USS Chesapeake, and USS Constellation.

We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

Tony Swofford, Author of “Jarhead”

VBC Scuttlebutt welcomes bestselling author Tony Swofford to talk about his iconic memoir, Jarhead: A Marine’s Chronicle of the Gulf War and Other Battles.

The book is a raw and unflinching memoir that delves into the experiences of a Marine sniper during the First Gulf War. Swofford, who enlisted in the U.S. Marine Corps at a young age, offers a gritty, firsthand account of the psychological and emotional challenges faced by soldiers both on and off the battlefield.

The book begins with Swofford’s grueling training as a Marine, where he is shaped into a skilled sniper. The narrative is filled with vivid descriptions of the dehumanizing aspects of military life, where individuality is stripped away, and soldiers are conditioned to kill. Swofford doesn’t shy away from depicting the harsh realities of military culture, including the intense physical and mental pressures that lead to a profound sense of alienation and existential angst.

When Swofford and his unit are deployed to the Saudi Arabian desert during Operation Desert Storm, the anticipation of combat weighs heavily on the soldiers. However, much of their time is spent in a state of frustrating inactivity, enduring the boredom and psychological strain of waiting for a battle that never comes. The memoir captures the paradox of modern warfare, where the soldiers’ most significant battles are often fought within themselves rather than against the enemy.

Swofford’s account is deeply introspective, exploring his inner turmoil and disillusionment with the war. He reflects on the violence and destruction inherent in his role as a sniper, the moral ambiguity of war, and the impact of his service on his sense of identity. The book is not just a war memoir but also a meditation on the personal costs of being a soldier—the loss of innocence, the struggle with post-traumatic stress, and the difficulty of reintegrating into civilian life after experiencing the horrors of war.

Jarhead is notable for its stark, unromanticized portrayal of military life. Swofford’s writing is direct and honest, offering a sobering view of the emotional toll that war takes on those who fight it. His account challenges the glorified image of war often seen in popular culture, revealing the deep psychological scars left on soldiers.

In 2005, Jarhead was adapted into a Hollywood movie directed by Sam Mendes and starring Jake Gyllenhaal as Anthony “Swoff” Swofford. The film stays true to the tone and themes of the book, focusing on the boredom, frustration, and internal conflicts faced by Marines during the Gulf War. While the movie captures the desolate landscapes and the tension of waiting for combat, it also highlights the camaraderie and dark humor that soldiers use to cope with the psychological stress of war.

The film was well-received for its performances and cinematography, though some critics noted that it, like the book, is more of a character study than a traditional war movie. It emphasizes the psychological effects of war over action, making it a unique entry in the war film genre. Both the book and the movie offer a compelling look at the complexities of military life and the lasting impact of war on those who serve.

We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

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Kristin Hannah, Author of “The Women”

VBC Scuttlebutt welcomes bestselling author Kristin Hannah to talk about her wildy popular and well-reviewed novel The Women.

The book tells the story of Frances “Frankie” McGrath, a young woman from a privileged California family who defies societal expectations to serve as an Army nurse during the Vietnam War. Frankie’s decision to enlist is driven by a sense of duty and a desire to prove herself, but she quickly learns that war is far more brutal and complex than she imagined.

In Vietnam, Frankie is thrust into a world of chaos, tending to wounded soldiers and witnessing the devastating effects of combat. The novel vividly portrays the harsh realities of war, including the physical and emotional toll it takes on both soldiers and those who care for them. Hannah doesn’t shy away from the trauma and loss that define Frankie’s experience, capturing the fear, exhaustion, and helplessness that pervade her days in the field.

Frankie’s return to the United States is marked by a profound sense of disillusionment. She comes home to a country that is deeply divided over the war, and instead of receiving recognition for her service, she faces indifference and hostility. The novel explores the stark contrast between the hero’s welcome expected by returning soldiers and the cold reception many Vietnam veterans actually received, particularly women. Frankie’s struggles with post-traumatic stress, guilt, and the overwhelming sense of isolation highlight the emotional burden carried by those who served.

As she tries to reintegrate into civilian life, Frankie finds herself alienated not only by society but also by her own family, who cannot understand what she has been through. The novel examines the psychological impact of war, particularly the way it haunts veterans long after they leave the battlefield. Frankie’s internal battle is as harrowing as the war itself, as she grapples with the memories of those she couldn’t save and the moral complexities of her actions.

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We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

The Indomitable Spirit of Vietnam POW Ralph Galati

Ralph Galati shares the story of his harrowing experience as a prisoner of war (POW) during the Vietnam War.

Galati’s capture occurred during Operation Linebacker, an air campaign aimed at disrupting North Vietnamese supply lines and military infrastructure. On February 16, 1972, while on a mission, Galati’s F-4 Phantom II was struck by enemy fire. Ejecting from the aircraft, he and his fellow pilot, Bill Hill, were quickly captured by North Vietnamese forces. They were then transported to the infamous “Hanoi Hilton,” nickname of the Hoa Lo Prison.

The conditions at the Hanoi Hilton were severe, with prisoners subjected to physical and psychological torture, malnutrition, and isolation. Despite these conditions, Galati, like many of his fellow POWs, displayed remarkable resilience. The camaraderie among the prisoners was crucial to their survival, as they developed a covert communication system using taps and codes to maintain morale and share information. This support network helped them endure the harsh treatment and isolation imposed by their captors.

Galati’s faith and determination played a significant role in his ability to withstand the hardships of captivity. He has often spoken about how his belief in God and his love for his family gave him the strength to persevere. His experience as a POW also deepened his sense of duty and commitment to his fellow servicemen, inspiring him to become a strong advocate for veterans’ issues after his release.

After spending nearly 14 months in captivity, Ralph Galati was released on March 28, 1973, as part of Operation Homecoming, the repatriation of American POWs following the Paris Peace Accords. Upon returning to the United States, he transitioned from active duty to a role in the Air Force Reserves and later pursued a civilian career in business and education.

Galati has been an active voice in veteran communities, sharing his story to inspire and educate others about the realities of war and the resilience of the human spirit. He has worked extensively with organizations that support veterans and their families, emphasizing the importance of remembering the sacrifices made by servicemen and women. His story is not just one of survival but also of leadership and service, as he continues to dedicate his life to helping others, particularly those who have served in the military.

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We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

The American Hero Myth with Marine Veteran Brian O’Hare

In his award-winning book of short stories, Surrender, Brian O’Hare delves into the complexities of the American hero myth and its impact on his own life. As the son of a larger-than-life Marine officer, O’Hare was drawn to the allure of military service, seeking to emulate his father’s legacy.

However, after witnessing the devastating effects of war on his father’s health, O’Hare began to question the validity of the hero myth. He realized that the idealized image of the American hero, often portrayed in Hollywood films and popular culture, was far removed from the realities of combat.

Brian O’Hare is a graduate of the US Naval Academy, former Marine Corps officer and Persian Gulf War veteran.  Currently, he’s an award-winning writer and filmmaker living in Los Angeles. His work has appeared in War, Literature and the Arts; Hobart,Electric Literature and others, and has been nominated for two Pushcart Prizes. Most recently, National Book Award winner Phil Klay awarded Brian Syracuse University Press’ 2021 Veterans Writing Award for Surrender.

Through his writing, O’Hare deconstructs the myth of the team captain and the Marine, exposing the flaws and vulnerabilities that lie beneath the surface. He explores the psychological toll that war takes on individuals, the sacrifices they make, and the lasting scars they bear.

O’Hare’s journey is a personal one, but it also resonates with a broader cultural shift. As society evolves, so too does our understanding of heroism. The traditional notions of masculinity and military prowess are being challenged, and new definitions of heroism are emerging.

In Surrender, O’Hare invites us to question our own assumptions about what it means to be a hero. He suggests that true heroism lies not in physical strength or military glory, but in the courage to face our own mortality, to embrace our imperfections, and to strive for a more just and compassionate world.

As O’Hare reflects on his father’s legacy and his own experiences, he grapples with the question of what he will pass on to his son. He recognizes that the American hero myth is a powerful force, but he also believes that it is essential to challenge its limitations and to create a more inclusive and nuanced understanding of heroism.

Through his writing, O’Hare hopes to inspire others to embark on their own journeys of self-discovery and to question the myths that shape our society. By demythologizing the American hero myth, he opens up the possibility for a more authentic and meaningful definition of heroism to emerge.

We’re grateful to UPMC for Life and Tobacco Free Adagio Health for sponsoring this event!

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Should We Distinguish “Combat Veterans” from Others Who Served?

VBC Scuttlebutt Open Conversation poses the question: does the term “combat veteran” demean the service of “rear echelon” soldiers, sailors, and Marines?

Author and Vietnam veteran Marc Leepson thinks it does.

We discuss this question. 

Leepson published an article in Vietnam magazine in 2019, recently reprinted on Vietnam War website cherrieswriter.com, titled “What Did You Do in Vietnam?”

Leepson writes:

I admire and respect every Vietnam veteran who served in the combat arms. . . . . But using “combat veteran” obliquely demeans the service of all of us clerks, cooks, truck drivers and other rear-echelon types. I realize that most people who use that term don’t intend to minimize or mock the wartime service of hundreds of thousands of other veterans, but that’s exactly what it does.

I was astonished to see British journalist Max Hastings go out of his way in his recent, big history of the war, Vietnam: An Epic Tragedy 1945-1975, to deride the service of anyone who wasn’t humping the boonies in Vietnam. How else to interpret this snarky, condescending sentence in which he sums up all rear echeloners’ war service:

“Maybe two-thirds of the men who came home calling themselves veterans—entitled to wear the medal and talk about their PTSD troubles—had been exposed to no greater risk than a man might incur from ill-judged sex or ‘bad shit’ drugs.”

I understand that infantrymen could have negative feelings about us rear echeloners, but we were doing the jobs the military asked us to. And in Vietnam, contrary to Hastings’ ridiculous generalization, you were in danger no matter where you were.

Although there are no official statistics, the best estimate is that 75 to 90 percent of those who served in Vietnam were in support units. That’s more than 2 million men and women who came home without the label “combat veteran.”

My suggestion to fellow veterans and those who never put on the uniform: Please consider dropping “combat veteran” from your vocabulary and replace it with “war veteran.” Or “Vietnam War veteran.” Or “Iraq War veteran” or “Afghanistan War veteran.”

We’re curious to know how many in our Veterans Breakfast Club group feel similarly. We’d also like to hear from those who think that distinguishing between comabt and non-combat service is a reasonable and even necessary way of acknowledging the different kinds of Armed Forces service.

The VBC has a strong and long track record of serious and civil conversations that divide the veterans and military community, and this conversation will be no different.

And, of course, we’ll also talk about any other subjects you might like to bring up.

So, join our friendly, interactive gathering of veterans, friends of veterans, and history nerds discussing whatever aspects of military service, past or present, or the veterans community that are on your minds.

Join us to swap stories, good and bad, at home and overseas, old and new. At the VBC, veterans from every era and branch are drawn together by the warm glow of shared purpose.

These stories aren’t just for veterans; they’re for everyone who wants to understand the lives of those who served. Whether you’re a veteran seeking camaraderie, a civilian wanting to learn, or simply someone who appreciates the value of service, the VBC welcomes you with open arms. Join us online – become part of their mission to honor stories, build bridges, and ensure that every day is Veterans Day.

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